: This has got to be one of the most ridiculous questions that Ive ever heard. You might as well ask "How do you know cows dont fly?". Any reasonably intellegent person cannot possibly believe that a blade of grass,an eggplant, etc.. have any capacity whatsoever to feel physical pain or have any cognitive ability to comprehend pain or any other circumstance it may be subjected to.You seem to think I'm being stupid about this, I'm not I'm perfectly genuine and science has proven my point thier are trees in Africa or somewhere that when eaten by animals give of a chemical that makes other plants of the same species aware of thier plight and these plants guard themselves by sprouting temporary thorns.
The thing is, things die, they no doubt suffer in the process because they have differing capacity for knowledge or cognative behaviour doesnt matter to me, if you are going to kill to survive then why is one sort of killling more "good" than the other?
:How dare you "presume"
Now just step back and think about what your saying, I've seen tons of animal rights debates go all irrational and silly and it means that every time the issue, which is a real important issue, is raise people think it's proponents are loonies or cranks.
Being civil costs nothing.
:that just because a simple organism like a plant experiences life and death that it also experiences anything remotely close to what a mammal experiences during that life. Were you reared on this planet or some bizarro world?
I'm waiting for you to be rational so I'll excuse you this time.
: : I dont appreciate people telling me what I think, I'm perfectly aware what I think, I do enjoy meat and I find factory farming etc. cruel, what I'm trying to do is inject some rationalism into this debate not this oh the poor animals nonsense.
: Well your attempt at trying has failed; youre ideas are totally irrational- or at least completely illogical.
Yours are so better, it's great to debate with people who stack the deck against you to make your position appear insane, who dont rely on evidence, who are keen on simply rubbishing the individual if they cant rubbish the argument.
: : : If you're still not convinced, I invite you to go to Farm Sanctary or even a petting zoo where they have cows and pigs. Spend time with those animals. Get to know them as individuals. Then take a knife and look at them and the weeds growing at their feet. Which one could you kill?
: : What is this? The use of animals for entertainment in a peting zoo or as pets or whatever is at least as terrible as their exploitation for food, if not worse at times.
: His point wasnt to advocate petting zoo's- he was trying to get you to see the difference between plant life and living animal's, which have a personality, a brain, and the ability to understand fear and pain- unlike weeds
I know what he was doing, it's the kind of pathetic, and I mean PATHETIC, moralising that I'm used to from veggies etc. do you really think your going to convince anyone of your position by attacking them like this?
:(although that is evidently beyond your ability to comprehend).
How many insults is that now?
:Interesting how you purposely skip over his point (because you realize there is no logical retort to it) and move on to an off topic issue.
I didnt skip over his point what was it? That I should instantly empathise with cows or sheep if I met them in person? That is plain stupid if you ask me, indeed it's illogical.
: : : You're attempting to justify the unnecessary killing of animals when plant alternatives are available. Moreover, you're doing so in an era of intensive factory farming, a practice only 50 years old, and so cruel and despicable that it is hard to imagine anyone honestly saying they are not ashamed that people do such a thing to animals. I do believe that one day factory farming will be seen as the nightmare it is and abolished, and that people will look back and wonder how we let it happen. When you buy meat, Lark, you support this heinous system.
: : : So don't continue to post ridiculous queries about the suffering of plants versus the suffering of animals. Face up to reality and really think about the monstrous system you are for some reason attempting to defend.
: : I'm defending nothing I'm exposing flaws in your argument, which it would appear is nothing more than a demonisation of people who disagree.
: I may have missed the "flaws" in his argument. What were they?
Such outrage and angst, God help the animals you people are trying to help, I'm quite sympathetic to the position of animal rights activists but this loony irrational emotive nonsense is going to do nothing other than drive the whole issue further and further on to the fringes of politics and rational debate.
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McSpotlight: Sorry about the double post there...:P
(Lark; perhaps you'd care to comment on the points I originally raised; I'd be interested to know what your responses to those are?)
