Day 144 - 28 Jun 95 - Page 21

     
     1        committees, or whatever they were called, but in the United
     2        States (which is what you know about) there is no
     3        organisation to represent employees in group negotiations,
     4        as it were, with McDonald's or its franchisees?
     5        A.  If I understand the question, my Lord, under the
     6        National Labour Relations Act it would be illegal to
     7        recognise anyone other than a union in that context.
     8
     9   Q.   Yes, but we went through all this before.  You have, you
    10        say, rap sessions, crew meetings?
    11        A.  Correct.
    12
    13   Q.   You may or may not have union recognition?
    14        A.  That is correct.
    15
    16   Q.   At the moment in the United States you do not; there is
    17        nothing in the system which provides for groups of
    18        employees getting together in order to negotiate terms and
    19        conditions, including pay, with McDonald's or a franchisee?
    20        A.  If you might, my Lord, we are now getting into
         technical areas of the National Labour Relations Act and,
    22        if I may for a second, employees have a right if they wish
    23        to represent themselves collectively with an employer
    24        without a union, with or without a union, my Lord.  An
    25        employer would be obligated in those circumstances under
    26        the National Labour Relations Act to recognise and
    27        negotiate with the employees, if they represent a majority
    28        of the employees in that appropriate unit we had talked
    29        about.  So, employees -----
    30
    31   Q.   There is nothing in the McDonald's system which expressly
    32        provides for that happening?
    33        A.  Or it says it cannot happen.
    34
    35   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  No, we have been through all this.
    36
    37   MR. MORRIS:  Yes, I know.  (To the witness):  I put it to you --
    38        perhaps to cut to the issue -- you cannot compare -- it is
    39        a trick of language, is it not, Mr. Stein, when your Crew
    40        Handbooks characterise a number of organisations as a third
         party or outside organisations and try to claim that trade
    42        unions are somehow equivalent to insurance salesmen and
    43        religious groups and environmental organisations; it is a
    44        trick?
    45        A.  Totally untrue.  It is not a trick.  There is a
    46        business purpose for it.  I have articulated time and time
    47        the business purpose.
    48
    49   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Do you want to go on now or do you want the
    50        five-minute break there? 
    51 
    52   MS. STEEL:   We can carry on. 
    53
    54   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  It is the normal time.  We will break now
    55        unless you particularly want to ask further questions.
    56
    57                       (Short Adjournment)
    58
    59   MS. STEEL:   Mr. Stein, we have a witness called Sarah Ingliss
    60        from Canada who tried to organise the Orangeville store,