Day 131 - 06 Jun 95 - Page 64

     
     1        compiled, you developed health and safety management
     2        systems at McDonald's?
     3        A.  I was making specific input with Jill, and we were
     4        reviewing the systems and saying what was going to be
     5        developed, and so on, but it was not in terms of an audit.
     6
     7   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I think what you are being asked is, if you
     8        are asked to look into McDonald's operation in this country
     9        and make recommendations about how health and safety could
    10        be improved, either by introducing specific practices or
    11        eliminating specific practices or setting up a system of
    12        supervision, or whatever it may be, then one can understand
    13        that.
    14        A.  Yes.
    15
    16   Q.   But what you are being asked is:  just what was it that you
    17        were asked to do?  I understand the 1986 job.
    18        A.  Yes.  I was on one specific task.
    19
    20   Q.   If you were not asked to look at the whole outfit and make
         recommendations from your point of view of your independent
    22        expertise, what were you being asked to do?
    23        A.  Originally, I was asked to do specific tasks, which is
    24        what tends to happen.  I was asked originally to say: "Let
    25        us set up a system for COSHH", a system which was new to
    26        industry generally, and to see that the model was right.
    27        When we had done that, we looked at Jill's own development,
    28        at training and developing, what training course had
    29        taken,, and so on and so forth.  That was part of it.  She
    30        started that rolling.  We had discussions about the safety
    31        policy documentation and things that would be brought into
    32        -- how we would structure it along the term.  It is
    33        difficult, however, to say that was a specific criticism
    34        made at that time, because it does not work like that.
    35
    36        It is also, similarly, rather difficult to telescope over
    37        five years and say:  "It was that particular year or that
    38        particular month I made that particular input."
    39
    40   Q.   So what it amounts to, from time to time, Mrs. Barnes asked
         you for your advice on particular topics relating to health
    42        and safety?
    43        A.  Absolutely.  We specifically looked, I know, at
    44        accident reporting and RIDDOR statistics, and so on and so
    45        forth, and put together things that Jill could begin to
    46        feed into a management team, to say that this is a subject,
    47        and so on and so forth.  But it tends to be that sort of
    48        specific input.  I certainly made a training contribution
    49        at a fairly early stage, but it would be difficult to say
    50        when, though. 
    51 
    52   MR. MORRIS:  One of the things in that list we just looked at 
    53        was preventing burns in the kitchen?
    54        A.  Yes.
    55
    56   Q.   Inadequate or no expressed performance standards for that.
    57        In the RIDDOR statistics, I think there is -- I may be
    58        right, I might be wrong -- no reference to burns, and yet
    59        they are a major concern, along with slips and falls.
    60        Would you accept that, in terms of -----