Day 120 - 03 May 95 - Page 34

     
     1        enormous detail.
     2
     3   MR. RAMPTON:  One cannot touch on a little part of it without
     4        touching on the whole, because otherwise the witness, who
     5        knows nothing about the case anyway, is left in ignorance
     6        of the true facts.  That is the trouble with it.  It is
     7        much better not to ask questions about it at all, in my
     8        submission.
     9
    10   MR. MORRIS:  The fact is, Mr. Nicholson, is that the ruling by
    11        the Rights Commissioner in Ireland, at, or round the time
    12        when you took over responsibility, was that two members of
    13        staff were sacked for encouraging other employees to join
    14        the -----
    15        A.  I would point-----
    16
    17   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  That is not a question, that is a statement
    18        made by Mr. Morris.  All I want to know from you is did you
    19        know about either of those cases, anything about them?
    20        A.  I think this is the case, but this was a franchised
         store, the franchisee is responsibility for his employees,
    22        his or her employees.
    23
    24   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  That is the McCann matter is it, and O'Brien?
    25        A.  Yes, I am sure this is the same one that I was informed
    26        about in due course.  But the franchisee is responsible for
    27        his or her own employees.
    28
    29   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Can we just pause a moment.  It just is not
    30        clear to me from either of those documents whether
    31        McDonald's had any involvement whatsoever.  In this country
    32        we normally have the title of the matter, whether it is an
    33        industrial tribunal application or an ordinary action, and
    34        it starts off "Mr. Mr. McCann was employed by the Company"
    35        and the second one starts off "Mr. O'Brien was employed by
    36        the Company".  Are you suggesting the Company is a
    37        McDonald's Corporation of some kind?
    38
    39   MR. MORRIS:  It says, after the Transport & General Workers
    40        Union it has got, stroke, at the top, "Pantry Franchise
         Ireland Limited"?
    42        A.  Yes, that is the franchisee's company
    43
    44   MR. MORRIS:  That is the McDonald's -----
    45
    46   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  No.
    47
    48   THE WITNESS:  No.
    49
    50   MR. MORRIS:  That was a franchisee of the McDonald's system? 
    51        A.  They are responsible for their own employees. 
    52 
    53   Q.   But they are part of the McDonald's system?
    54        A.  Yes.
    55
    56   Q.   Do you have a difficulty with taking credit or
    57        responsibility for your franchisees?
    58
    59   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I do, when the contract of employment is
    60        between the franchisee and the employee.