Day 109 - 28 Mar 95 - Page 24
1 we need to go into that.
2 A. No. It does refer here as well to the work of Barry
3 Hughes that I was talking about, about the wire floors of
4 the cages. She does refer to that -- she says to nearly
5 everyone's surprise -----
6
7 MR. MORRIS: Could you just identify the page?
8 A. That is page 152, the top paragraph, the first
9 paragraph in the middle of it.
10
11 MS. STEEL: In the middle of the first paragraph?
12 A. Yes, roughly line 12 down, something like that.
13
14 Q. The choice between wire mesh and peat or earth or wood
15 shavings is dealt with on page 153?
16 A. Yes, well, I think that is fairly obvious really, the
17 desirability of a terra firma as opposed to wire, but yes.
18
19 Q. I think you said yesterday who Marion Stamp Dawkins is?
20 A. Well, she is -- sorry?
21
22 Q. I am not sure whether you did or not.
23 A. She is in the department of Zoology at Oxford
24 University, and she has done research for the RSPCA since,
25 I think, the 1970s -- in fact, I know because we went to
26 see part of her research as long ago as that.
27
28 Q. That was into animal behaviour?
29 A. Well, particularly, the battery cage, yes. She is an
30 animal behaviourist generally, but she has done a lot of
31 work on hens.
32
33 Q. Right. In this court there has been reference made to free
34 range systems, the problems with free range systems are
35 just as great as battery systems, and conditions are no
36 better for the chickens and that cannibalism is just as
37 bad. I cannot remember exactly what has been said, but
38 could you possibly explain just what the definition of free
39 range encompasses and make any comment?
40 A. Well, at the moment it is really a marketing standard
41 which I -----
42
43 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I could avoid reading something in my Sundays
44 papers about that?
45 A. Oh, yes, well, that was a very prime example of
46 the ------
47
48 Q. The complaint at the moment is that it is totally
49 meaningless.
50 A. Yes, well, that farm that was detailed is one that
51 I know personally, and that is an example of a truly
52 wanting free range farm, and yet it is able to sell as
53 "free range", so that when people say cannibalism, high
54 mortality and so on, I think it is vital -- I did have a
55 letter published in Veterinary Records some years, and it
56 was after some research of Dr. Gregory's which was
57 published, about the broken bones, high incidence of broken
58 bones in free range hens or may be they were perchery -- I
59 think it was a mixture -- and I say that it was absolutely
60 vital to define what was meant by free range within the
