Day 108 - 27 Mar 95 - Page 17

     
     1        that does not stop them ----
     2
     3   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  They are trying to dust-bathe although----
     4        A.  Yes, they are carrying out all the motions of it.
     5
     6   Q.   They are on an inappropriate floor and they damage
     7        themselves sometimes as a result?
     8        A.  Yes.
     9
    10   MS. STEEL: Dr. Gregory said that the oasters birds were kept
    11        five to a cage and would have their usual stocking density
    12        of roughly 450 square centimetres each floor space.  Would
    13        your general concern about the battery system also apply to
    14        the chickens at oasters where the eggs are produced from
    15        chickens kept in those conditions?
    16        A.  I assume it is typical.  Most cages with five birds are
    17        18 by 20 inches which is roughly 450 square centimetres
    18        each, and I would assume that they are typical cages.
    19
    20   Q.   Do you think that chickens in such condition can be said to
         have freedom of movement?
    22        A.  No, I think they do very little except jostle with each
    23        other.  They have no freedom of movement in the true
    24        sense.  Sometimes they have not enough head room.  The same
    25        Dr. Dawkins has measured the amount of head movements.
    26        Often, as you know, chickens raise their heads and look
    27        around and elongate their necks and very often there is not
    28        sufficient head room in cages for this.
    29
    30   Q.   The chickens that we saw on that video, I believe there was
    31        one trying to stretch its wing out.  Is that fairly
    32        typical, the amount of space shown on that video?
    33        A.  Yes.  A chicken with both wings fully expanded measures
    34        roughly 30 inches across and very few battery cages measure
    35        that.  Most are 20 inches to five birds.  So it is true to
    36        say they could never extend both wings at once fully.  They
    37        can probably do one at a time but that will be over the
    38        bodies of the others of course.
    39
    40   Q.   Could they even extend them both at once if there were no
         other birds in the cage?
    42        A.  No, they are too wide for this.
    43
    44   Q.   I do not know whether I have asked this already, but how
    45        many batteries hens have you bought over the years?
    46        A.  I have not logged it but I would think it is certainly
    47        in the hundreds.
    48
    49   Q.   Right.  What has struck you about the hens?
    50        A.  Very, very many of them have been severely defeathered, 
    51        quite a lot have been debeaked but not all.  Very many have 
    52        been what I would describe as pathetic ---- 
    53
    54   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Quite a lot have been?
    55        A.  Debeaked but not all.  It tends to be if they are
    56        reasonably well feathered they are debeaked and, therefore,
    57        have not been able to peck each other's feathers out.  It
    58        is more common to find them with their beaks intact but
    59        very few feathers remaining. Sometimes we have had the
    60        beginnings of cannibalism showing in the skin.