Day 061 - 05 Dec 94 - Page 36

     
     1        submission, and of course the reasons why they say it is
     2        so.
     3
     4   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  It does not matter, it may not have to be
     5        Mr. Oakley, but to someone who might be in steer in
     6        McDonald's, maybe that is right, maybe that is Mr. Oakley,
     7        that, on balance, reusables would be environmentally
     8        beneficial, then put the basis upon which you are going to
     9        suggest that be so, in case he has an answer to it.
    10
    11   MR. RAMPTON:  Your Lordship will remember it was dealt with by
    12        Mr. Langert.
    13
    14   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I remember that and I remember ---
    15
    16   MR. RAMPTON:  I raised it -----
    17
    18   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  -- it was raised by the witness who came from
    19        America, Mr. Lipsett -- I had forgotten his name, I am
    20        afraid.  It was put to Mr. Langert from his point of view.
         If you have a basis to put, a positive case to put, put it
    22        to this witness.  If you have not got a positive case, you
    23        are just going to make some general comment, then there we
    24        are.
    25
    26   MR. MORRIS:  I put it to you that your packaging is wasteful and
    27        damaging to the environment, firstly, and, secondly, there
    28        are alternatives.  So, would you agree with the first one,
    29        your packaging is wasteful and damaging to the
    30        environment?
    31        A.  No, I do not think it is.  I think it is necessary to
    32        run our business.
    33
    34   Q.   It is necessary but it is damaging to the environment?
    35        A.  I do not think so.
    36
    37   Q.   It is not damaging to the environment?
    38        A.  I do not think so.
    39
    40   Q.   Packaging?
         A.  It goes into landfill of which there is plenty.
    42
    43   Q.   So the production ---
    44        A.  Or is recycled.
    45
    46   Q.   -- the resources, the transportation and the disposal as a
    47        whole is not damaging to the environment?
    48        A.  No, it is the only way we can hygienically serve our
    49        food.
    50 
    51   Q.   Hang on.  There are two questions here.  There is the 
    52        question whether it is necessary and the question whether 
    53        it is damaging.  Would you accept that from everything we
    54        have heard about the production of polystyrene paper, its
    55        transportation, usage and disposal, is it damaging to the
    56        environment?
    57        A.  No, I do not think it is.
    58
    59   Q.   So when McDonald's says something is not damaging to the
    60        environment, we can now compare it to the fact that use of