Day 016 - 22 Jul 94 - Page 21

     
     1        when he is reading something out.
 
     2   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I want him to, so I can take it on board.
              I am going to have to decide this case at the end of the
     3        day; if I do not follow as it goes along, it will be
              difficult.
     4
         MR. MORRIS: "Doll and Peto have pointed out that in diet,
     5        protective agents may be of more practical importance than
              causative agents.  Before we can make strong
     6        recommendations to the public, it is essential to
              understand the relative importance of causative and
     7        protective agents".  Do you agree that this survey paper,
              which "May indicate there is an association between a diet
     8        which is high in fat or meat and a high incidence of
              cancer of the breast or cancer of the colon" is largely a
     9        statistical association?
              A.  Yes.
    10
         Q.   But it does not establish cause and effect, in your
         opinion?
              A.  That is correct.
    12
         Q.   Right.  So would it be fair to say there is a statistical
    13        link but not a chemical link?
              A.  Well, perhaps we should say a metabolic link or
    14        something of that order.
 
    15   Q.   A statistical link but not a metabolical link?
              A.  Yes, that is what it says.  I have no reason to change
    16        my mind.
 
    17   Q.   Are there other surveys -- Richard Doll and Richard Peto,
              are they sticking their necks out on that conclusion, or
    18        there is a body of thought which agrees with that kind of
              conclusion?
    19        A.  Well, that was the result of a very thorough review of
              the available literature up to that time.  As I say, it
    20        was about 1981 and, in my opinion, it is a fair reflection
              of the state of the art at that time.
    21
         Q.   Would that have been repeated by other top researchers in
    22        their field such as those people throughout the 1980's for
              example, that there were lots of surveys which had that
    23        kind of conclusion, statistical link, rather than cause
              and effect link -- sorry, answer the question first?
    24        A.  Yes, there have been other studies, yes, which would
              be broadly in line with that.
    25
         Q.   Right.  Were there any studies, so far as you know, which 
    26        have, in their own opinion, whether flawed or not, claimed 
              to have established a causal link? 
    27        A.  I cannot recall anywhere where I would say that would
              be the case.
    28
         MS. STEEL:  We have not had the five minute break yet.  Is it
    29        possible to have it now?
 
    30   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Yes.  I had forgotten about that.  Just one
              question about that answer.  The word which Mr. Morris