: I'm not saying that what functions as an atom may not exist. My point was that what actually exists may one day be recognized as something different.You might want to put some qualifiers on that statement, Gotch; because if you believe that that is the case, then what you think of as God might one day be recognized as the Devil...
: As far as physical evidence for you and for Gideon, another analogy: If you were walking through the woods and came upon a watch, would you assume that it happened to be put together by chance, or that it was made by a watchmaker? Obviously, it was designed and made.
Gotch, I've shot this one full of holes already; you even admitted as much. See this message.
You quoted Ennos Wolthius as saying "It must be clearly understood that such a statement of faith cannot be subjected to the rigorous proof of experimentation or logic."
If you assume that a watch implies a watchmaker, that's exactly what you're trying to do. 'Cause' and 'effect' are logical concepts; if you believe them to be universal, then you cannot exclude God from them.
If God is subject to causality, then Something created God. This is obviously grand heresy to any Christian.
As such, you cannot believe that causality is universal. And if causality isn't universal, then you cannot say that a watch implies a watchmaker.
If a watch automatically implied a watchmaker; then causality would be universal; and God would have been created by Something.
In trying to use causality to provide argument for God, you are doing exactly what Wolthius warned against; trying to apply logical concepts to a faith.
The watchmaker argument just doesn't cut the mustard; it is fundamentally unsound. Please don't use it again; this is the second time I've had to tell you.
: Why then, when looking at something much more complex like cells, atoms, etc., do so many assume they all happened by merely random chance? It doesn't make sense to me.
To be frank, logic isn't your strong suit, Gotch.
Take the equation Z(n+1) = Z(n)2 + c
(In other words, Znew = Zold2 + c)
Simple-looking equation, yes? - not too many variables, fractions or unusual terms?; look at the plot of the solutions...
Apparent complexity can be the result of very very simple numbers, Gotch.
Gideon.
None.
