Day 008 - 07 Jul 94 - Page 06

     
     1
              Landfills in the United States in the late 80s were
     2        decreasing and it was estimated when I joined the company,
              when I joined Perseco in 1988, there might have been
     3        10,000 landfills at that time, or so, estimated to
              decrease over the next two to four years down to 3,000
     4        landfills.
 
     5        What was happening at the time was that recycling
              programmes were developing in the communities and
     6        recyclables were put on the kerb side, yet there were big
              gluts of materials and they were not being recycled.  They
     7        were put in landfills anyway.  We felt again the
              responsibility to provide more focus in order to come up
     8        with solutions related to our solid waste impact.
 
     9   Q.   Suppose it was suggested, Mr. Langert, that was simply a
              reaction by McDonald's to public opinion and an attempt,
    10        as it were, to ingratiate itself with the customers; what
              would be your reaction to that?
         A.  I would not agree with that assessment because it was
              apparent to me in my responsibilities that there were real
    12        issues to deal with.  There were real solid waste issues,
              and within McDonald's there are real issues in terms of
    13        what we can do to manage our solid waste.  Customer
              concern for the environment was part of the equation
    14        because our customers cared (and still today care very
              much) about the environment.
    15
              So, in that respect not only were we responding to what we
    16        felt was a business need based on our business judgment,
              but it also hand in hand did respond to a growing consumer
    17        reality that they too were concerned about the environment
              as we were.
    18
         Q.   So it is good business too, in effect?
    19        A.  Well, I can give you many examples; one of the
              pleasures of working on the environmental issues within
    20        McDonald's is that practically everything we have done
              related to the environment either has not added money, or
         it has saved money for the company.  That has been part,
              I guess, of our enthusiasm for continuing environmental
    22        initiatives.  That, in general, as a general guiding
              principle, when you reduce your environmental impact you
    23        also reduce your cost to business.
 
    24   Q.   Are there occasions when, in fact, an environmental
              measure taken is going to cost more to take it than if you
    25        did not do it?
              A.  Yes. 
    26 
         Q.   In that situation, does someone in the company sit down 
    27        and say:  "Well, that does not matter because we will
              recoup that in terms of customer goodwill"?
    28        A.  Again, it is a decision making process and we do not
              make decisions on cost alone.  We have made decisions
    29        where we will pay extra money because of whatever we
              believe in based on the information we are getting.
    30
         Q.   Mr. Langert, again forgive me, this may seem a somewhat